Tuesday, February 18, 2014

No move for us right now

It is snowing again....I know that February is a heavy snow month....but I think I speak for all of us that have had a very cold, snowy winter.....ENOUGH.

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We found out that G-man is not being considered for the new position he applied for recently.  So at this time, no move for us.  I honestly think part of the problem is that they have a computer "read" the applications/resumes and it looks for key words.  If you don't have the key word, even if you have a synonym....you get scored lower.  Each job has a minimum score to be passed on to a real person for consideration.  We have been down this path before.

One thing that we discussed (as much as you can discuss it in a text conversation), was his grade application.  For those who don't know how the federal gov't works....each job is assigned a numerical "grade" and then each grade has 10 "steps" in between.  You can only apply for a job that is no more than 2 grades above your current job.  G-man is a Grade 8, step 10, which is the very top for his current position.

You can apply for a position that is lower than your current position.  Yes, it is a back step.  Yes, it is a pay cut.  However, in MOST circumstances, it is a temporary thing, and within a year you are bumped up.  But this is in no way a guarantee.

We are starting to wonder if the problem is applying for the Grade 9 position.  There is nothing that says you can't do it, but there may be an internal ranking system that is screwing us up.  He can apply for the 7 and the 9....and if it gets passed along....they could offer him the 7.

Why would we consider this......it is a pay cut and a downgrade of grade?  Because it is a career path that would bring him to a 12 at some point in the future.  Right now....and for as long as he is in this position....there will be NO raises (other than cost of living, and that isn't a guarantee)....there will be no promotions....there will be nothing....this is as good as it gets.  A different career path has room for growth.

(Again, the federal government works in a totally different way than the private sector.  He isn't changing careers....it is just what they call it.  The position he just applied for is a different position than what he is doing now, but his career is with this agency).

It gives us something to think about....would we be able to take a pay cut and still do what we need to do? 

We are currently in the experiment of saving 50% of his 2nd job pay to see if we can, and then we would know that this pile of money would be able to go towards debt.  (as a side note, we totally picked the WRONG month to start this experiment....the snow is screwing with my paycheck with all the closures, but we are still doing it).  Unless my pay totally changed, I can say with 100% guarantee that the second job money would not be saved...it would have to go towards our regular expenses to make up for the cut.

No decisions on any of it yet.  This job is gone, but there will be more jobs in the future for him to apply for....and we may apply for the 7/9 and see what happens.  Even if he is offered the 7, we can still turn it down if we really think it won't work.  And knowing that it may be a year....it may be longer.....that is a tough pill to swallow.  But if it really was only a year....and knowing where we are projected to be in a year.....it is worth serious thought. 

21 comments:

  1. My ex's family worked for the government, so I remember hearing about these salary grades. When I graduated college, I desperately wanted to land a job in that arena, but boy was it DIFFICULT! I ended up taking my first full-time job with a large insurance company (still here to this day). They operate a different, yet somewhat similar system of salary grades:

    Each job is assigned a SG with a minimum and maxium salary potential. However, these min/max are dependent on the type of job. A SG 30 in one department might start out with a base pay higher than a SG 30 in a different area. There's no rule how high/quickly you can promote, but it's pretty unheard of to move more than 2 or 3 SG's up. Higher SG's require more experience, education/certifications, etc.

    To go a step further, raises (to get you to that maximum), are based on a percentage of your SG. For example, some SG's have a potential raise earning of 5% of your salary if you 'meet' expectations, which is a "3". Other jobs have 10% and up (the more prestigious your job, the higher percentage). If you exceed expectations, you could potentially earn more, but those type of ratings are hard to come by. The percent of raise you receive in April-ish (IF they're given of course) is dependent on your year-end review from the year prior.

    In my current position, I am a SG30. I make barely above the minimum, far from the maximum of $64,400. I have the potential of earning a 10% raise. *fingers crossed* the work I did in my new job last year (I was only in this position for 4 months in 2013) earns me score of 3 and a 10% raise. But alas, there is more to consider. Sometimes when you're promoted a SG, which I was... 29 to 30, you're denied a raise the following year. EVEN IF your promotion only garnered you a minimal raise of (in my case) $500ish. Not $500 a month, $500 in total.

    It's all very calculated and sometimes unfair when certain departments decide to ignore the rules and do their own thing. But I'm still grateful for the opportunity to earn raises and bonuses.

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    1. It is amazing how complicated they make some of these things!!!

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    2. I just realized looking back at what I shared that it was FAR too detailed for a simple 'comment' LOL!!

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  2. Public sector sure sounds complicated... but I can understand being in a similar position for the private sector and being in a line of work where you can't get ahead unless you transfer into another ladder and move a few steps back, but with a higher ceiling than the current work. I am currently in a similar position, so moving and starting elsewhere may be my only chance for serious advancement.

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    1. I think you will benefit greatly once you are able to get to Chi-town and have a fresh start!

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  3. Mysti -

    A couple of things. First - I was in the government 20 plus years and changed jobs a few times - including moving from admin to a professional series and then from one professional series to a different one. And benefitted from a few career ladders (5 to 12) and (11 to 13). And I took a step back from a 12 to an 11 to switch professions. And I have review/scored/interviewed applicants at all levels. I just say all this so you know I understand the crazy rules of government hiring. So my advice.
    Don't' bother applying for a job if the key words haven't been worked into the resume. Either a machine or a HR person who doesn't know the job and is just following a checklist will put the application in the no pile without those words. Equivalent experience is meaningless at that point. It is meaningful when the next person reviews it but you need the key words to get it there.

    I think you and Gman are right to consider a 7/9 and he should apply at both levels - there is an advantage to being the best qualified 7. And he may not need to take a pay cut depending where on the 8 ladder he is. They will actually pay him up to 2 steps more if there is room on the scale. So if he is say an 8 step 5 he could end up with more money as a 7 step 9 (just making up the levels!). That being said - don't count on the automatic promotion after 1 year. When I was moving up the ladders it was standard but in the last 5 years at the agency I worked at and where friends worked - this started to stop and people spent two or more years at each grade before being promoted - even those who scored very highly on appraisals. You just never know so make sure you can do more than a year at the lower grade. Last thing- make sure Gman can still work the 2nd job in the new position - it may not be a conflict but the management may frown on it (allowed but held against you).

    Last thing on the resume - always make sure the job is explained - I looked at a lot of colleagues resumes when they applied for higher level positions and while I knew what they meant when they said they "did X" - because they didn't explain the skills they used - they never got far in the process. Hiring folks usually have to go by what is on the paper. And even. If they don't HAVE to - it is an easy way to get excluded from a job if the person doesn't like the applicant or wants someone else to get the job. Sad but true.

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    1. Thanks for the comments.

      1) Keywords...we don't know what they are looking for! He has restated answers based on the words used in the questions, and then were told they weren't what they wanted. We have reused words in both the questions and the resume.

      2) He is an 8 step 10. We already looked at the pay scale and I *think* the lateral was a 9 step 4 going up, and I don't remember the 7....but at the top of the 7 it was something like 5k less. Like I said....at his office it has been promotion in about a year, but we know that isn't a guarantee.

      3) His 2nd job isn't an issue. He has been there 10 years and the office knew about it. No conflict at the office. HOWEVER....it would mean a change in schedule at the 2nd job, and they won't be happy (he works 2nd shift at the office, so he does 1st shift at the store. this would get flipped if he gets a new job).

      4) Can you elaborate what you mean by "job is explained?" I know what we have put...but just curious what you mean. Feel free to e-mail me at mysti1031 AT yahoo DOT com.

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  4. We had to make that choice about 20 years ago. We chose the pay cut for the promise of a better future. It worked out, but it was a hard decision with hard consequences. Good luck!

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    1. I really wish there was a way of KNOWING how long the consequence would be for. Guess we all wish that, huh???

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  5. Has he ever thought of getting a job in the private sector? I'm not sure if you've mentioned anything regarding this before.

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    1. Nope. He has too much time in on the government side. We would lose pension. Additionally, he doesn't have a college degree. His options in the private sector would be considerably limited.

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  6. Painful area, my hubs has never had so much as a promotion and was the last person to receive a Sr. status in his office. It has been an embarrassing long ride and he won't even consider a promotion. Really makes me mad. But why should he I can just work harder.

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    1. And what would happen if YOU didn't work harder.....one person can't carry it all.

      G-man has been with this agency from the beginning of his gov't career. It is 22 or 23 yrs at this point. And his job is considered "entry level", even though he is at the top of the pay scale for his job. It is frustrating that it took me so long to get him to really look towards other things. He really should be at a 10 by now...

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  7. In my industry it's who you know, not what you know- you learn on the job.

    Does he know any of the managers in the other roles/ locations?

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    1. Who you know only works if you get past round one...which is done by a computer at headquarters. Once it gets to the hiring person...then maybe you have a better chance. But the hiring person only sees what is passed by the computer. They never know anything about the rest. And even if you go to them, then can't overide the system.

      He doesn't know anyone at the other location....the one person he knew is no longer there. At his current office, he talked to a few managers who all said he has the qualifications and ability to do this job. But the computer disagreed.

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  8. This is a very confusing system. I think I wouldn't like how the most qualified person for a raise has to go through the steps. Some people deserve more of a raise than others.

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  9. At my job you hit top rate in 5 years and that is it forever. No amount of extra education will change it. We get small pay equity raises yearly. Unless you want to apply for a management position(no thanks) then you will be making the same rate until you leave.

    Government jobs here in Ontario are where people are raking in the big money. Of course this is not sustainable as you can't keep raising taxes to keep the privileged few living the high life.

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  10. By the way does your husband have a post secondary education? He is likely competing against many people with degrees.

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    1. No. He has a H'S diploma. I spent a long time trying to encourage him to get a degree. I think NOW he understands the importance, but the timing isn't right.

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